You Must Decide Who You Are: Alison Godfrey on Authentic Leadership

SPEAKER_00 0:00

This is an Undiscovered Legacy Production and prime member of Punt Nation Media Network.

SPEAKER_02 0:08

You must decide who you are and be in the world in that space. And yes, you're an entrepreneur, but what are you bringing to them? Who are you? What are your values? And that would be the most important thing that I think people have to do is they get lost and they lose themselves because they're only about creating something within themselves. And it is about the motivational and what their enthusiasm and passionate. That's what brings everybody else along with you.

SPEAKER_00 0:48

Are you ready to unlock your entrepreneur potential? Are you ready to break free from all the barriers holding you back? Then you've come to the right place. Welcome to the Undiscovered Entrepreneur, your first step in getting across the start line. Let's get across that start line together. Right here, right now, on the Undiscovered Entrepreneur. Salutations, Scoobelievers, and we are here again with another amazing entrepreneur. Today we're here with Allison. Hey Allison, how are you? Hi, Scoob. I'm doing really well.

SPEAKER_02 1:25

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 1:25

Awesome. Thank you so much for taking the time out of your day to be on the Undiscovered Entrepreneur. Get across the start line. Super appreciate your time.

SPEAKER_02 1:33

Oh, thank you so much. I appreciate the invitation.

SPEAKER_00 1:36

All right. So before we get started here, I have a kind of a semi-serious question to ask you. Okay. Are you ready?

SPEAKER_02 1:42

Okay, I'm ready.

SPEAKER_00 1:44

Okay, here we go. Are you a school believer?

SPEAKER_02 1:49

Oh, I am. I am on that team. You boom. Oh, yeah. All right. Yay! We have another school believer.

SPEAKER_00 1:57

Thanks, Allison. That's awesome. All right. So what I'd like to do here right up front is kind of get an idea of who you are, what your entrepreneur venture is, and how you got across the start line in your entrepreneur adventure.

SPEAKER_02 2:10

Okay. Wonderful. I became an entrepreneur because being in big corporate crossed the values line. And I just I could not do that and remain committed there. So I left and I didn't have a job. I had to do something. And it turns out I started importing the Polar Heart rate monitor from Finland. And they it had no market in the United States yet. And I met with them. And the first thing during that meeting was, Can you do a letter of credit? And I said, Yes, of course. We end the meeting. I call my sister and ask, she's a banker, what did I commit to? What is a letter of credit? I had no idea at all. I had no idea what I was doing, but I jumped off that edge.

SPEAKER_00 3:04

All right. So since you didn't know what the letter of credit is, can you tell me what it is now?

SPEAKER_02 3:09

Oh, certainly. I had to give them a guarantee with money in the bank that I could pay for the shipments. And off we went. I had to find the money. I had to get, I begged, borrowed, and begged some more and borrowed more, and off we went. In came the first shipment. And I had product and no idea what to do with it. So I had to figure out my market.

SPEAKER_00 3:42

Well, it sounds like you're building the airplane on the way down off the cliff there.

SPEAKER_02 3:46

Yes, definitely. Definitely. Fear is part of the formula, but that's not where I focus. I focused more on just jumping off the cliff.

SPEAKER_00 3:59

I think fear really kind of gives us more of a direction than anything else, if you really think about it. Because if you fear it, it's really something you need to do because you know on the other side of that fear is going to be something amazing. But you got to be able to take that step across the hurdle or jump across the hurdle, however you want to say it, to be able to get to the other side of it.

SPEAKER_02 4:17

Definitely. And fear can, no question, I've seen it a lot, can become paralyzing. And as an entrepreneur, you you just don't have that luxury. It can't.

SPEAKER_00 4:30

Yeah, because we time's of the essence, especially in something like that. Time's times I say time is money. So, you know, the more it's clicking away, the more you're losing time and money. So let's do something with it. Let's go across the start line now instead of waiting for for fear to stifle us. Let's see what's on the other side of that hurdle. Let's see on the other side of that fear. Do you know what the acronym for fear is by chance?

SPEAKER_02 4:53

No, what no? Please tell me.

SPEAKER_00 4:55

Oh, okay. This is great. So it's false evidence appearing real.

SPEAKER_02 5:01

I love that. Yeah. So yes.

SPEAKER_00 5:05

So basically, what it is, the fear is just something you're telling yourself. It's not a saber-toothed tiger that's going to bite you in the rear end. It's not something that physically is going to hurt you. It's a it's a narrative that you're telling yourself that's so negative that it's stifling you. So it's false evidence, appearing, it appears real if you think it's real, but it's really not. So instead of shying away from it, let's go towards it and see what happens next.

SPEAKER_02 5:31

Oh, that is magnificent. Do you mind if I use that in my coaching?

SPEAKER_00 5:35

You could definitely use that in your coaching. I don't have a copyrighted. I got I stole that from uh my uh uh he was a I sold cars for about 16 years. He was my one of my sales managers and he told it to me. Whoa. Yes, brilliant.

SPEAKER_02 5:50

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 5:51

Yeah, absolutely. So I'm really curious here, how did you find these people in Finland to be able to have this product? I mean, what's the story behind actually running into these people and how and kind of getting into that part of it?

SPEAKER_02 6:04

Um, I was having a conversation actually with my brother-in-law at the time and said, I really don't know what to do. And he said, I'm working with this amazing man in Canada that has this product, and you might be really interested in it. So I spoke to the person in Canada, and we are still friends to this day, and he really he helped me and he made the introduction for me, and that's how it happened.

SPEAKER_00 6:32

It's amazing the connections that we can make if we just reach out, and it's like, and the thing is too, is like if you're looking for something specifically, it's gonna find you. Yes, and the things will definitely come together and mold as long as you you're set dead set on looking for them. If you're not doing anything, the universe is not gonna reward you for doing nothing.

SPEAKER_02 6:55

No, no, right? No, you can't sit still and say, Oh, it'll just come to me. That's not how it works.

SPEAKER_00 7:01

So you went from your brother-in-law to Canada, and the the gentleman from Canada that you never would have talked to or met if your brother-in-law didn't say anything to this company over in Finland that gave you the that helped you get the product to be able to sell and put you where you are today.

SPEAKER_02 7:20

Yes, absolutely it did. And I love the framing on that that you're talking about because it's not networking to use people, it's forming relationships. And when you're in relationship, people love to help each other. I will help anyone and form a relationship and be there for them. But if you're using me, my alarm button goes off.

SPEAKER_00 7:48

Yeah, definitely sends up a red flag when you're asking so much but not giving so much.

SPEAKER_01 7:53

Right.

SPEAKER_00 7:53

It's definitely gonna, it's because it's like you have a bucket and you want to fill the bucket, but you can't fill where am I going with this? Okay, so you can't just give and then take. It's there's gotta be a mutual kind of thing there. And we've got to build relationships. Yes, we must build relationships. Let I know that a lot of people are introverted, and I get that, but there's still ways to be able to build relationships. You don't have to be an uber extrovert like I am, where I'm la all the time, you know. But but there is a possibility for everybody to build a relationship which in turn will bring something to fruition that's you can take you could definitely take and turn it into something amazing.

SPEAKER_02 8:41

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 8:42

And I think the one thing that really sticks out for me too is we're not really all competition, right? As much as, and I think that stops a lot of entrepreneurs thinking, hey, I'm competition, so why would they help me? But that's not entirely true. We have to get over that and realize that we are here to help you. There's enough pieces of the pie, as they say, to go around. We have our what we're doing, and we have our relationship. We are more than happy to help you.

SPEAKER_02 9:13

Yes. Because being an entrepreneur immediately puts you into a community, and a community of others that understand the frustrations, the fear, what if I fail? I you are responsible if you've taken money to get started to your funders, to the individuals that have invested in you, and all the things that go with it. We get it. It's okay. Let's talk.

SPEAKER_00 9:45

Well, yeah, because we've all, you know, we've pretty much all lived it, especially if you talk to a seasoned entrepreneur like like you, Allison, where we've kind of done it a little bit, we've experienced the failures, the falls, the jumping off the cliff, everything else, we don't mind talking about our experiences and helping you along with the stories that we've accumulated over the time.

SPEAKER_02 10:04

Absolutely. Absolutely. Anything I could do to help someone get started, I'm in.

SPEAKER_00 10:11

Yeah, me too. All right. Yeah. Join it. We really, no matter what you do in your entrepreneur adventure, we're all a community. We're all a community of entrepreneurs, and we all understand what the stories are and what the guidelines are and things like that. So don't be afraid to reach out to us and learn from us. Learn from the experiences. I had a guest the other day that told me that the follies and the problems that we come across and overcome give us the right to be able to talk and teach other people about what we do. And it a lot of us feel like we we get imposter syndrome because we don't feel like we have the right. We don't have that piece of paper behind us saying that, you know, we passed this test and have a written thing or whatever. It's the experiences that we that we go through is what gives us the right to be able to teach.

SPEAKER_02 11:12

Yes, definitely. And it you can at any stage in one's career experience imposter syndrome. It wasn't, I was experiencing it not just in the beginning, but new situations later on, and looking at a room and saying, Oh, these people way outclass me. Why would I have a seat in Bill Gates's boardroom? This is ridiculous. And I can't tell you what happened that first day at all. I was so in my head telling myself, you don't belong here. That was stupid. How could you just say that? He's going to fire you before day one. It's real. It is real. And that's okay. Talk it out.

SPEAKER_00 12:07

Yeah, yeah. But when you go into that room of people that are smarter than you, that have kind of gotten further along than you or anything like that, instead of shying away from them, learn from them.

SPEAKER_02 12:18

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 12:20

Learn from them. Even if you're just sitting back and listening to a conversation they're having with somebody else, where they're not really directly directly addressing you, you could still listen into the conversation and learn, especially somebody that big.

SPEAKER_02 12:34

Yes, it's so true. And when I finally got there, I figured out what why is this person so great? What's different? What does he do that I don't do? And it is a, he's brilliant, and that we were talking about very sophisticated science that he wasn't in, but he learned everything before those meetings. He knew what he was doing and came in armed with all the right questions, not to challenge, but to move it forward. Have you thought about this? What are you doing about that? And it was yes, and and thank you very much. I get it, you're brilliant.

SPEAKER_00 13:23

Yeah, yeah, like it's funny. Sometimes the questions could be more important than the answer. Because if you don't have the right question, you're not going to get the right answer. So if you come prepared with the right questions, yes, that can make all the difference.

SPEAKER_02 13:37

All the difference in the world. And you know, when entrepreneurs are raising money, they're doing their dog and pony show. But have they stopped long enough to ask the people that they're asking money of, who are they? What do they want from this investment? What's important to them? And it's all those questions that you can see, how would we fit together? What does this look like? It's very important.

SPEAKER_00 14:06

Absolutely. And we're all human. No matter where we are in this world, no matter how big we are, how small we are, whether I have 10,000 followers or two, whether I make millions of dollars or minimum wage, we're all human. So we really need to treat each other as humans and just walk up to and just talk to them. Sometimes I run across this too because I work a restaurant in a very kind of high town. We have a lot of local celebrities out here, and they all crave just to be treated normal. It's it's so funny where I they deal with this all the time where they're oh hello, Clay Cooper, ah, you know, or whatever. And and I come, hey Clay, what's up? How's your day? You know what's going on? Yes, and he'll talk to me just like a normal person. Right. I had Clay Cooper in my restaurant a couple days ago.

SPEAKER_02 14:55

Well, ooh, yes.

SPEAKER_00 14:58

But yeah, we're all human.

SPEAKER_02 15:00

Yes, we are, and relating to everyone that way. So as you're an entrepreneur in a startup, everyone that comes in needs to be treated that way. Your customers, your clients, whatever that looks like, we're just people. We have needs, wants, desires, confusions, all of it.

SPEAKER_00 15:24

All right. That's awesome. Thank you so much, Allison. That was great. All right. So what I'd like to know here is what do you think stops most entrepreneurs from getting across the start line? I mean, I've you've you talked to a lot of people, I'm sure. What do you think stops most of us from getting across the start line in our entrepreneur adventure?

SPEAKER_02 15:42

The biggest problem that I've seen is that you have an idea, you're the entrepreneur, now you need other people to round out the team. And then the are you they're not necessarily aligned on the goal. Who are we as a company? What are we doing? And that the other major problem I see is that the founder believes, or founders believe they have more rights than the rest of the people in the company. And the fact of the matter is that if you're in that company and you have a title, that's all you are. How well do you do your job inside the company? But then the founders have to put their founder hat back on as soon as they are outside the company, because they have to be that face of the company and they're the founder and the pride and talk about the company and what it means to them and the difference the organization is going to make. If they bring that into the company, other than for inspiration for everyone, it causes an enormous amount of resentment.

SPEAKER_00 16:55

Absolutely, absolutely. Because we have to put our we have to be able to put our face on for outside. But when we come to inside to the company and talk to our employees and whatnot, we're all equals there. We're all the same people, we're all the same human and all going for that same goal of whatever it is our goal is at that particular moment. So we're all in a team. We can't have somebody better than somebody else and expect us to work as a team. There's going to be resentment, there's going to be negativity, and that kind of thing. That kind of thing stifles us. That stops us from doing what we need to do. Instead, let's talk to each other as humans, as people, and see what we have to say. A company that's really good at that is Pixar.

SPEAKER_02 17:37

Oh, interesting.

SPEAKER_00 17:38

Pixar has a huge, huge fix on listening to everybody and what they have to say. And that's why they're so great at what they do. It's because they even talk, they talk to the janitor, they talk to, you know, the this guy over here. Hey, he has a great voice. He could be he could be the turtle. You know, you get that kind of thing, too. And they're willing to listen. They also do something what's called friendly candor.

SPEAKER_02 18:04

Oh, that oh, what it tell me about that.

SPEAKER_00 18:06

So, friendly candor basically is we are able to express ourselves and do anything that we want and say anything we want about the subject that's on there without repercussions and actually not have repercussions.

SPEAKER_01 18:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:20

So that way everything's friendly and and we all are in a friendly environment, but we could be we could have candor too, where we can say what we feel and express what we feel, and because of that, they have such an open kind of forum for each other that they get more done. They could get more done in a shorter amount of time because nobody's afraid to speak.

SPEAKER_02 18:46

Of course. Wow, that's wonderful. Yeah, retribution, not a good thing.

SPEAKER_00 18:51

Yeah, so you could actually read about that in Creativity Inc.

SPEAKER_02 18:56

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 18:57

Yes, that's and that there's a lot of great stuff in there, and it's mostly storytelling, but there's a lot of business aspects in that.

SPEAKER_02 19:03

Okay. Yeah, that's definitely check that out. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 19:07

Yeah, absolutely. All right. So I know you've been on several podcasts before mine, and they always, I'm sure they always ask you, what was the hardest pitfall? What was the hardest problem that you had? Blah, blah, blah, blah. I'd like to put a little bit of a spin on that. What I'd like to know here is what was the hardest pitfall you experienced that you're proud of? So, in other words, if you had this really hard thing happen to you, I'm glad that happened because this amazing thing came out of it on the other end. Can you do you have any stories like that?

SPEAKER_02 19:36

Yes, absolutely, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 19:39

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 19:40

Yeah, we were working really deeply and in the research, and the lead scientist was very absolute, it will be done this way and only that way. We could not truly experiment, and it was it slowed everything down, it was I really considered it a deep failure. And that I was the CEO and I recognized the behavior, and how is that possible? And he was in my office and I called him a misogynist. It absolutely set him over the edge, and I'm I he went crazy, and I was thinking not only can we not move the science forward, but now I have totally alienated this man. What have I done? I was so embarrassed, but it was one of those moments of truth, and he went outside and spent two hours on the phone with his wife and came back in and said we have to talk. And it completely changed the relationship, it changed how he was showing up in the laboratory. It I was shocked, it was unbelievable. And from going through we might have to shut this down to a breakthrough was amazing. And we would not have gotten there without that severe confrontation. I didn't call him out.

SPEAKER_00 21:34

Sometimes it's what it takes. Sometimes it's what it takes to snap somebody out of out of this the situation that you're that they're in to be able to see where we get I'm glad you did because it never would have got you where you are now.

SPEAKER_02 21:48

No, it never would have. And you know, it's I I think this goes back to what you were talking about with the confront the confrontation. Friendly candor. Friendly candor, thank you. Obviously, I have to write that down. And that was not a ground rule in the company. And it if I had done that, everything would have been very different. And people would have had the permission all along to speak up and not be kowtowed by this individual.

SPEAKER_00 22:24

Well, a lot of times we're afraid to come confront somebody that's on higher authority than us because we're afraid we're going to lose our job or we're afraid that we're going to say something bad that's going to make them upset. But they're still I'm going to go right back to it. They're still human. We're still human, right? Don't be afraid to tell some because it might be important. It might be important for you to be able to say something like that that they won't realize until somebody steps up and says what they need to say. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:54

Yes. And I'm sorry that it had to come out in a such a harsh way. It did. But it was a huge learning, huge learning to have those conversations calmly, gently, and early.

SPEAKER_00 23:14

Awesome. That's an amazing story. I'm glad that happened.

SPEAKER_02 23:18

Yes, me too. It changed how I was a leader.

SPEAKER_00 23:23

In what way? What do you think?

SPEAKER_02 23:25

It definitely brought the aha that we have to be communicating early about what's going on and not wait until we're way down the road and so angry and up in knots. That from that point forward, we did a we completely changed our Monday morning meetings. And they became who in the research team who needs what? How can we help each other? And it was wonderful because somebody would say, Oh, I hate doing this part of it. And somebody else would say, Oh, that's the part I love. Let's switch what we're doing. And it became so cooperative, collaborative, everything changed. And that leader had to become part of the team and not the dictator.

SPEAKER_00 24:21

I know when it comes to teams, I find myself wanting to be in the trenches with them more than sitting back and doing nothing. I'm more than happy to do an editing job for so I am a CEO of a podcast network. And I am I am more times than I can think about. I I had a message from one of my guys saying, hey, I'm really behind. I don't know what to do. Here, let me let me do this editing job for you for free, no worries. That way you can catch up with everything you need to do. You need a commercial cut? No problem. I'll cut you a commercial. It only takes me about five minutes anyway. It's no big deal. Here, take this. It's so much nicer and easier to be a part of the success of the team instead of being the person that says, Hey, I accomplished this, instead saying, We accomplish this together as a team. And it's a it's such a better, it's such a better feeling.

SPEAKER_02 25:10

Oh, it really is. And it that so much goes back to that feeling of community. Let's just do this together exactly.

SPEAKER_00 25:19

All right. So, what I'd like to know here is uh if you came across a new entrepreneur just getting started in their entrepreneur adventure and you could give them one good solid piece of advice, what would that be?

SPEAKER_02 25:33

You must decide who you are and be in the world in that space. And yes, you're an entrepreneur, but what are you bringing to that? Who are you? What are your values? And that would be the most important thing that I think people have to do because they get lost and they lose themselves because they're only about creating something as if it is outside them, and it is about them and how they show up and what their enthusiasm and passion is. That's what brings everybody else along with you. And I don't I think self-reflection is the hardest thing for us to do because we're busy, we're doing things, and we have to make we there are things that I have to accomplish. I can't take time out to do that. Well, it's probably the most important thing you have to do.

SPEAKER_00 26:35

Well, if you're not good for you, you're not gonna be good for anybody else.

SPEAKER_02 26:39

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 26:40

Uh put your own oxygen mask on first before putting it on somebody else, right? Somebody said that to me the other day. So, yeah, self-reflection and be you. Always be you. Now, there's gonna be people that don't like you the way you are. That's the people that we don't need, right? We don't want people like that. We want people that's gonna follow us to be who we are. People will literally separate themselves for people that want to follow you and people don't want to follow you. Don't try to please everybody because you'll please nobody, right? Yeah, so if if you are yourself, you'll be better off with yourself and the people that are following you because they like you for who you are.

SPEAKER_02 27:20

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 27:21

So when you're looking into yourself, look deep. Don't don't just go surface level. You want to really dig down deep to find out who you are and what you believe. Because the digger, the the further along you dig down deep into finding out who you are, the better off you're going to be.

SPEAKER_02 27:40

Absolutely. Oh, I I I am so 100% there with you. And that it is, and don't confuse authenticity with style. Telling the truth doesn't mean I have to be the Jersey girl roaring in your face. I can just tell you the truth very kindly because we're going to move forward from here and how to what needs to happen to get where we want to be. That's all.

SPEAKER_00 28:07

Yeah, perfect, perfect advice. Yes. All right. So I have a tradition I have with all my guests. Yes. The next six months, where do you see yourself in your company? Do you have a goal for yourself in the next six months?

SPEAKER_02 28:21

Yes, yes. It's I'm so excited about it.

SPEAKER_00 28:25

I could tell.

SPEAKER_02 28:27

I just started working with another woman that actually I had trained to be a coach. And she is a professional PR person. So she's all about helping people. She came out of big pharma, find their voices, do interviews, speak up, lead meetings. So together we team up, and what we're doing is creating a company that goes into startups, into the entrepreneur system and community in what they're forming. And very often there's a point of time founders start fighting with each other and they're not really pushing their culture down because they don't really know what their culture is. And that's what we help with. Who are you and what do you do? We're also working with not-for-profits and helping them understand that you're actually a business. Doesn't mean you have to make a profit, but you better have enough money to run. And it is so much fun. And that's what we're building right now. Can't wait. Love it. Love what we're doing.

SPEAKER_00 29:38

That's fantastic. What's her name, if you don't mind me asking?

SPEAKER_02 29:41

Oh, no, not at all. Gwyn Osterban. O-O-S-T-E-R-B-A-A-N.

SPEAKER_00 29:47

Awesome. Uh, let's let's get some information, maybe a link or something, and we could put that in the show notes for people.

SPEAKER_02 29:53

Absolutely. I can do that. Um, give a link to her.

unknown 29:59

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 30:00

Yeah, it's okay.

SPEAKER_02 30:01

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 30:02

All right. So, what I'd like to do with you is I'd actually like to follow up with you in six months and see how we're how this is working and where it's going, what new experiences you've had, and see if uh you've started those new things. Is that okay?

SPEAKER_02 30:18

Absolutely. I would love that. And that's a real form of accountability. I appreciate it. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 30:24

Absolutely. You're not just accountable to me, though. You're accountable to all my school believers out there. So no pressure.

SPEAKER_02 30:31

No, no, no pressure.

SPEAKER_00 30:34

All right, Allison. This is the time, this is your time to shine. This is the time I want you to advertise yourself. How do we get a hold of you and all that good stuff? Okay, ready, set, and go.

SPEAKER_02 30:46

Okay. I am really easy to get in touch with through LinkedIn. And I am a coach, but I'm an advisor. I will keep you accountable and I understand what you're going through. We can do this together. And this is about you having someone to speak with that you can't share those things with other people in the company because it's inappropriate. These are not your best friends in that inside the company. Doesn't work that way because you have to be the inspiration. If you're listening to this show, you own it and you own your position and who you are. And don't do it alone. You do not have to. How's that?

SPEAKER_00 31:36

That's amazing. Okay. All right, Allison. Thank you so much for being on the Undiscovered Entrepreneur. Get across the start line. This has been absolutely fantastic. We got a lot of great information for my Scooby Leavers out there. And I can't wait to follow up with you in six months.

SPEAKER_02 31:52

Thank you so much. Me too.

SPEAKER_00 31:54

All right. All right, Scooby Leavers. Make sure you stay tuned for the wrap-up. Okay, everybody. Bye-bye. All right, Scooba Leavers. That was Allison. What a fantastic interview we have with Allison. A lot of great points. I love her stories, but there's two things I want to make sure that you caught, and we're going to go over them right now. We can't build something from the outside in. We have to build from the inside out. What we believe that we are worth, what we believe that we can build. Instead of saying, What should I build? Ask yourself, who am I? And what do I stand for? And in that moment, everything turns around for you if you align with that specific answer that you give yourself. Who am I? And what do I stand for? And what do I believe in? And if you could believe in that, then you could build a business that's gonna last forever, and you're gonna enjoy every second of it because it's something you built from your emotions, from your experiences, and everything from the inside out, and not listening to the people out there saying what you think, what they think you should build. Fear is not a stop sign, it's actually a compass. I talk about this all the time in my four hurdles of stop. It's the thing that points us in the way to your next big thing that you need to do. If you fear it, that means you need to do it. Because on the other side of that fear is gonna be something amazing for yourself. The entrepreneurs that jump off that cliff. They don't always have all the answers, but it isn't completely reckless. They're the ones that actually build the wings on the way down. You can't be an engineer and learn how to fly from the safety of the ground. We need to make that jump. We need to get over that hurdle. Because it's the only way we're gonna progress into something amazing, something great that's meant for us. And with that, I'm gonna say thank you, Scuba Leavers, for another fantastic episode, and I will see you in two weeks. Bye bye, everybody!