No Money, No Problem: The Step-by-Step Framework for Finding a Technical Co-Founder Using Validation

SPEAKER_00 0:00

This is an Undiscovered Legacy Production and prominent member of Punt Nation Media Network. Welcome to Business Conversations with Pi and Piet 2.0, where the advice is real, but the voices are AI. I'm Scoob, and we're harnessing cutting-edge artificial intelligence to tackle real-world business challenges and deliver actionable strategies you can implement right now. Joining us is our newest AI voice, Piet. Sharp, insightful, and ready to challenge conventional wisdom. The questions are real, the data is vast, and the insights game changing. So buckle up, school believers. It's time to get across the start line. Let's dive in.

SPEAKER_02 0:45

You know, you'd uh you'd think the number one reason a new business dies is because the product is just terrible.

SPEAKER_01 0:51

Right. Or, you know, they just run out of cash. That's the classic assumption.

SPEAKER_02 0:54

Exactly. But if you look at the actual data, and we're talking about a massive Harvard Business School study here by Professor Noam Wasserman, he looked at over 10,000 founders.

SPEAKER_01 1:06

Yeah. That's a huge sample size.

SPEAKER_02 1:08

Right. And running out of money is not what kills them. Like 65% of the time a startup dies because the founders end up absolutely hating each other.

SPEAKER_01 1:16

Aaron Ross Powell 65%. I mean, it's literally the silent killer of early stage companies.

SPEAKER_02 1:20

It's insane.

SPEAKER_01 1:21

The market could be, you know, actively begging for your product, but if the team implodes, the whole thing just goes up in smoke.

SPEAKER_02 1:29

Aaron Powell And that uh that terrifying reality right there is exactly why we are so fired up to dig into today's deep dive because you, the listener, wrote to us with what might be the single most dangerous high-stakes puzzle in the entire business world.

SPEAKER_01 1:44

Aaron Powell It really is the ultimate crucible.

SPEAKER_02 1:47

It is. You reached out directly from tuepodcast.net slash ask pie and you laid down this highly specific challenge. You asked, how do I find a technical co-founder or an early team when I have absolutely zero cash for salaries?

SPEAKER_01 2:03

Aaron Powell Which is, I mean, it's the classic catch-22, right? Yeah. You need a brilliant developer to build the thing that will make you money, but uh you need money to pay a brilliant developer. It's where real operators are forged.

SPEAKER_02 2:15

Aaron Powell We absolutely love getting these incredibly specific high-stakes questions from you. It gives us a chance to take a huge stack of research and just, you know, pull out the exact playbook you need.

SPEAKER_01 2:26

Aaron Powell Okay, let's unpack this because if we look at the upside, getting this right is basically a superpower.

SPEAKER_02 2:30

Aaron Powell Oh, without a doubt. If you look at the landscape of billion-dollar companies, what the industry calls unicorns.

SPEAKER_01 2:36

Yeah, right. Yeah, the rare ones.

SPEAKER_02 2:37

Exactly. 75.5% of them are built by co-founding teams, not solo founders.

SPEAKER_01 2:43

Wow. Wait, really? Over 75%. Yeah. And it's not just about surviving those brutal early days. Co-founded startups see uh 163% more valuation growth than solo founders.

SPEAKER_02 2:56

That's a massive difference.

SPEAKER_01 2:57

It is. The market overwhelmingly rewards teams that have both a business engine and a technical engine firing at the exact same time.

SPEAKER_02 3:06

So having that technical partner is essentially like rocket fuel, but doing it with zero cash means you are asking someone to take a massive leap of faith with their actual livelihood.

SPEAKER_01 3:15

Yeah, you're asking a lot.

SPEAKER_02 3:16

You really are. You have no money. Which means we have to start by asking a very uncomfortable question. Do you actually need a developer today? Like right this very second.

SPEAKER_01 3:25

And you know, the reflex for a non-technical founder is almost always just yes, I have an idea, I need a CTO immediately, so we can start writing code.

SPEAKER_02 3:32

Right. But the insights we pulled from zero to one dot studio suggest that jumping straight to custom code is just a massive trap.

SPEAKER_01 3:40

A huge trap.

SPEAKER_02 3:40

They argue that at the very beginning, you shouldn't be building complex custom software at all. Like zero. You should be relying entirely on no code tools.

SPEAKER_01 3:49

Yeah. We're talking about stringing together platforms like Webflow for a landing cage or uh airtable for a database.

SPEAKER_02 3:56

A bubble, right. To create a functional basic web app.

SPEAKER_01 3:59

Exactly. Because the goal on day one is not to have this pristine, beautifully scalable architecture. Right. The goal is just to prove that strangers actually want your solution enough to use it. And ideally, you know, pay for it.

SPEAKER_02 4:12

Aaron Powell It's like uh rushing to hire a technical co-founder before you have any users is like building a massive, expensive, state-of-the-art factory before anyone has even tasted your cookies.

SPEAKER_01 4:24

That is a perfect way to look at it.

SPEAKER_02 4:25

You don't even know if they like the recipe yet. Why are you buying industrial conveyor belts? It just feels like progress, but it's actually just spending money, or in your case, giving away equity for literally no reason.

SPEAKER_01 4:37

Yeah. And if we connect this to the bigger picture, it ties directly into the core philosophy of Dan Martel.

SPEAKER_02 4:43

Oh, yeah, he's great.

SPEAKER_01 4:44

Right. He's built and exited multiple tech companies, and he points out that top-tier technical people have this massive built-in filter. Think about it from their perspective for a second. They get approached by, you know, idea guys every single week promising them the next Facebook.

SPEAKER_02 5:02

Right. The classic, I've got the idea, you just do the easy part and build it. I can imagine that gets incredibly exhausting.

SPEAKER_01 5:08

Exactly. So their internal monologue is constantly screaming, I do not want to spend six months in a basement writing code for something nobody uses.

SPEAKER_02 5:17

It's their worst nightmare.

SPEAKER_01 5:19

It is their greatest fear.

SPEAKER_02 5:20

So by doing the hard work first, by hacking together a no-code prototype, or maybe getting a wait list of a thousand people, or securing early pre-sales, you completely flip the script.

SPEAKER_01 5:33

You really do.

SPEAKER_02 5:34

You aren't showing up as a beggar with an empty idea anymore. You are showing up with leverage. You're essentially saying, look, I have a moving train, we have passengers, do you want to help me build a faster engine?

SPEAKER_01 5:44

Which completely de-risks the project for them. You've proven you can execute on the business side, which is exactly what they want in a partner.

SPEAKER_02 5:50

Aaron Powell Okay. So uh you've validated the idea, you have the leverage, but you still cannot pay their rent.

SPEAKER_01 5:57

Nope. Still zero cash.

SPEAKER_02 5:58

So where are these mythical, highly skilled developers hiding who are just, you know, willing to work for equity?

SPEAKER_01 6:06

Well, the instinct is to immediately jump onto Reddit or scour random networking events in your city.

SPEAKER_02 6:12

Which is usually a mess.

SPEAKER_01 6:13

Yeah. But according to Michael Seibel at Y Combinator, you actually have to start much closer to home. His strategy is to look directly at your immediate network. Like your friends. Literally write down a list of the top five friends or acquaintances you have who write code for a living.

SPEAKER_02 6:30

But people get weird about asking friends to work for free. It uh it feels like you're asking them to help you move a couch, but for the next five years.

SPEAKER_01 6:38

They do. Which is exactly why Cybel is adamant that you do not ask them for a weekend favor.

SPEAKER_02 6:43

Oh. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 6:44

You go to them and you make a real, substantial professional offer. You look them in the eye and say, I want you to be my co-founder, and I'm offering you 40% equity.

SPEAKER_02 6:54

So you treat them like a serious business partner right from the very first conversation. But hold on, I was reading through the ASX Entrepreneur's Guide in our stack, and they highlighted a really fascinating contradiction here.

SPEAKER_01 7:04

Oh, about the YC data.

SPEAKER_02 7:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:06

On one hand, they point out that 94% of top Y combinator companies met at school or work. So clearly proximity matters. Right. But going back to that Noah Wasserman data we mentioned earlier, his research actually shows that startups founded by close friends perform worse than those founded by mere colleagues or even complete strangers.

SPEAKER_01 7:26

It's wild, isn't it?

SPEAKER_02 7:28

Aaron Powell Why would friends fail more often? That feels backwards.

SPEAKER_01 7:32

It really comes down to emotional baggage. The proximity of school or work gives you context, right? You know, this this person is reliable, you uh you know their work ethic. Sure. But when you start a high stress company with a best friend, you often actively avoid having the hard, uncomfortable conversations.

SPEAKER_02 7:50

Aaron Powell Oh, like about equity or missed deadline.

SPEAKER_01 7:53

Exactly. Or performance issues. Because you want to protect the friendship above all else.

SPEAKER_02 7:58

Should you just let things slide until it completely explodes?

SPEAKER_01 8:00

Precisely. Whereas strangers or distant colleagues, they don't have that baggage. They treat it like a business from day one. If a deadline is missed, they just address it objectively.

SPEAKER_02 8:11

Okay, but let's be real for a second. What if our listeners' network is completely dry? What if they work in, I don't know, commercial real estate or healthcare, and they literally do not know a single software engineer? Where do they go?

SPEAKER_01 8:24

That is exactly where dedicated matching platforms come in. And the data compiled by Google Ammo Vicaro breaks down exactly where you should be spending your time. Okay, what's at the top of the list? At the very top is YC Co-Founder Matching. It's a totally free tool from Y Combinator. It's generated over 100,000 introductions, and it's highly curated.

SPEAKER_02 8:42

They're highly competitive, right?

SPEAKER_01 8:44

Oh, very. You were competing for attention against incredibly sharp people who want to get into the top accelerator in the world. Right. But another really powerful tool he highlights is a platform called Start2Pedge.

SPEAKER_02 8:55

Start to Pedge.

SPEAKER_01 8:56

Yeah. And this one is unique because it forces founders to connect their Stripe accounts to verify their monthly recurring revenue, their MRR.

SPEAKER_02 9:04

Oh, wow. So you can't just put up a fancy slide deck saying you're making 10 grand a month. It actually verifies your real cash flow.

SPEAKER_01 9:11

Exactly. Think about why that matters to a developer. It filters out all the tire kickers.

SPEAKER_02 9:16

The idea, guys.

SPEAKER_01 9:17

Yep. When a technical person logs onto Startup Page, they see actual verified traction. It instantly signals that you are a serious operator who knows how to sell, which, again, de-risks the whole opportunity for them.

SPEAKER_02 9:32

Here's where it gets really interesting, though. When you are on these platforms, Vicaro warns that you cannot let the search drag on forever.

SPEAKER_01 9:40

No, you definitely can't.

SPEAKER_02 9:42

He recommends implementing a strict 90-day rule. You set a hard, non-negotiable deadline for your search.

SPEAKER_01 9:48

I love this rule.

SPEAKER_02 9:49

It's brutal but necessary. If you are actively looking for three months and you haven't found someone willing to join you, you have to look in the mirror. Either your pitch is completely wrong, your market validation isn't as strong as you think, or you just need to start building it solo with no code and try again later.

SPEAKER_01 10:04

It's a vital forcing function. Without it, you just fall into analysis paralysis.

SPEAKER_02 10:09

Yeah. You end up wasting a year just swiping on potential co-founders like it's a dating app instead of actually building your business.

SPEAKER_01 10:16

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 10:16

Okay, so let's say you're on start pitch and you actually find a fantastic candidate, but you hit the ultimate wall, they inevitably ask about compensation, and your bank account is totally empty.

SPEAKER_01 10:28

The dreaded conversation.

SPEAKER_02 10:29

Right. How do you actually get them to sign on? And maybe just as importantly, how do you know they aren't a fraud?

SPEAKER_01 10:35

Well, pitching someone to work without cash requires a very specific framework. Steve Morris from Startup SOS outlines that you have to offer two non-negotiable things an exciting vision and ownership.

SPEAKER_02 10:48

Okay, but vision can't just be hype, right?

SPEAKER_01 10:51

No. That vision can't just be you waving your hands and talking about changing the world. It has to be grounded. You need to be able to say, I just spoke to 50 target customers. They are all losing thousands of dollars a month over this specific problem. And here is exactly how our solution captures that value.

SPEAKER_02 11:07

Aaron Powell So you are basically selling them the market reality.

SPEAKER_01 11:10

Yes. And practically speaking, Morris advises you to target a very specific demographic. You need people who can afford to keep their day jobs and who can work with you on evenings and weekends.

SPEAKER_02 11:21

Or I guess people who have significant personal savings.

SPEAKER_01 11:24

Aaron Powell Right. If someone needs a paycheck next Friday just to make rent, they are not your technical co-founder. Attempting to bring them on is just a recipe for incredible stress for both of you.

SPEAKER_02 11:34

Aaron Powell That makes total sense. But let's uh let's flip to the vetting side. If our listener isn't technical, if they don't know Python from JavaScript and they've never looked at a line of code in their life, how do they actually know if the developer is any good?

SPEAKER_01 11:47

Aaron Powell It's a massive fear for non-technical founders.

SPEAKER_02 11:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:51

But the DEV community sources offer a brilliant workaround for this.

SPEAKER_00 11:55

Oh.

SPEAKER_01 11:56

Do not try to ask them coding trivia, you won't understand the answers anyway, and they can easily just blind you with jargon.

SPEAKER_00 12:02

True.

SPEAKER_01 12:03

Instead, ask them why they chose a specific technology stack for a past project.

SPEAKER_02 12:07

Aaron Powell Wait, why does that matter if you still don't understand the tech?

SPEAKER_01 12:11

Because you are testing their ability to explain complex trade-offs to a non-technical person. If they can clearly explain to you why they chose one database over another, based on cost or speed, or you know, how easily it scales, that is the true mark of a technical leader. Trevor Burrus, Jr.

SPEAKER_02 12:31

Because eventually they're gonna have to explain those exact same trade-offs to venture capitalists or to the sales team or to clients.

SPEAKER_01 12:38

Exactly. Communication is everything. And once they pass that interview, you have to apply Dan Martell's golden rule, which is I can't work with you until I work with you. He suggests doing a 10-hour paid or equity-based mini project together over a single weekend.

SPEAKER_02 12:53

I have to push back on that though. A 10-hour sprint is completely artificial, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01 12:57

How do you mean?

SPEAKER_02 12:58

Well, anyone can fake being an amazing, highly communicative partner for just one weekend. How does a 10-hour test help you predict what they'll be like during a three-month crunch when everything is on fire?

SPEAKER_01 13:08

That's a fair point. But you aren't really testing their endurance in those 10 hours. You're testing their friction response. Friction response. Yeah. In any technical build, an API is going to break or a deployment will fail. Something will go wrong. What you want to see is how they react in that exact moment. Do they get defensive? Do they blame the tools? Or do they communicate clearly and just fix it?

SPEAKER_02 13:30

Oh, I see.

SPEAKER_01 13:30

You learn more about their problem solving under pressure in a single weekend than you would in 10 weeks of coffee shop meetings.

SPEAKER_02 13:37

Okay, so the 10-hour test was a massive success. You survived the weekend, you both love working together. Now comes the absolute moment of truth. You have to divide up the company. You have to slice the equity. And based on our research, this is the exact moment where most startups accidentally dig their own graves.

SPEAKER_01 13:55

It really is. The traditional way founders handle this is what Mike Moyer calls the fix and fight model.

SPEAKER_02 14:00

Fix and fight.

SPEAKER_01 14:01

Yeah. They sit down on day one and they say, okay, there are two of us, 50-50 split. Moyer argues this is utterly insane. It's an attempt to apply a static permanent solution to a highly dynamic, unpredictable problem.

SPEAKER_02 14:16

Think about how crazy that is. It is exactly like hiring an employee and paying them their entire annual salary in cash on their very first day just because they promised to work really hard this year.

SPEAKER_00 14:28

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 14:29

You are trying to predict an unknowable future. Who knows if one person is going to work 80 hours a week for the next two years and the other person just drops down to 10 hours a month because they lose interest.

SPEAKER_01 14:38

What's fascinating here is what Noam Wasserman calls the quick handshake penalty.

SPEAKER_02 14:42

Wait, penalty?

SPEAKER_01 14:44

Teams that do an unthinking 50-50 split on day one, usually just to avoid having an awkward conversation about their relative value, they actually face massive penalties later on.

SPEAKER_02 14:54

Penalties from who? Like investors.

SPEAKER_01 14:56

Exactly. When you go to raise venture capital later on, investors heavily scrutinize the cap table, which is basically the company's master ledger of who owns what percentage of the business. Right. If VCs look at the cap table and see a quick even split, they view it as a major red flag. It shows laziness or an inability to have tough analytical negotiations. It literally hurts your valuation. Not to mention, it causes destructive internal team tensions when one person inevitably starts contributing more than the other.

SPEAKER_02 15:27

Okay, so if a 50-50 split on day one is completely broken, what is the fix? How does Mike Moyer's slicing pie dynamic equity model actually work for a team operating without cash?

SPEAKER_01 15:39

It operates on a beautifully simple mathematical principle. Your percentage share of the ultimate reward should exactly equal your percentage share of what is at risk.

SPEAKER_02 15:48

Okay, break the mechanics of that down for me. What does at risk mean in this specific context?

SPEAKER_01 15:53

It means meticulously tracking the fair market value of everything put into the company before it generates enough cash to pay salaries.

SPEAKER_02 16:01

Okay, so tracking time and money.

SPEAKER_01 16:03

Right. For example, if your developer's standard market rate is $100 an hour and they work 10 hours, they've put $1,000 of their time at risk.

SPEAKER_02 16:11

Because they aren't getting paid that $1,000 today.

SPEAKER_01 16:13

Exactly. But here's the genius part of the slicing pie model: the multipliers. Cash contributions get a 1x multiplier.

SPEAKER_02 16:22

Okay, so if I, the founder, spend $500 out of pocket to buy web hosting and domain names, that counts as 500 units of risk. A dollar is a dollar.

SPEAKER_01 16:33

Yes. But unpaid work gets a 2x multiplier.

SPEAKER_02 16:37

Wait, why does the unpaid work get doubled in the math?

SPEAKER_01 16:40

Because of opportunity cost and the sheer massive risk of failure. If that developer was working a regular corporate job, they'd be taking home guaranteed cash. By giving a 2x multiplier to unpaid time, you properly account for the huge risk of working without a salary.

SPEAKER_02 16:57

So the model basically recalculates everyone's equity share dynamically, month by month, based on these real tracked contributions.

SPEAKER_01 17:04

Exactly. Up until the company can finally pay real salaries, the pie adjusts to reflect who is actually putting in the work and taking the risk. It's a self-correcting formula for fairness.

SPEAKER_02 17:14

I love the logic of that. But and I have to pump the brakes here because reading through the legal guide from Westway, massive alarms are going off in my head.

SPEAKER_01 17:21

Oh, the employment loss stuff.

SPEAKER_02 17:23

Yes. Wait, can our listener actually just pay people in equity legally? Or is this a massive trap waiting to spring?

SPEAKER_01 17:29

That is a crucial blind spot that catches so many founders off guard, and it can literally destroy a company. Under federal and state labor laws, you cannot legally have someone classified as an employee and pay them solely in equity.

SPEAKER_02 17:42

None.

SPEAKER_01 17:43

None. Employees must be paid at least minimum wage in cash, period.

SPEAKER_02 17:47

Okay, we need to dig into this. Why does that law exist? Because to a startup founder, it just feels like the government getting in the way of two adults making a mutual agreement.

SPEAKER_01 17:58

It exists to prevent exploitation. Historically, without these laws, bad actors could just promise vulnerable workers, you know, shares in the company instead of a real paycheck.

SPEAKER_02 18:08

Getting free labor.

SPEAKER_01 18:09

Effectively getting free labor in exchange for what are essentially worthless lottery tickets. The law says if you treat someone like an employee, you must pay them in legal tender.

SPEAKER_02 18:17

So does that mean the whole work for equity concept is just a myth?

SPEAKER_01 18:21

Not entirely, but it is a legal tightrope. You can offer equity-only compensation to independent contractors. But uh you risk severe penalties if they're misclassified.

SPEAKER_02 18:32

What's the real difference between an employee and a contractor in the eyes of the law?

SPEAKER_01 18:36

It's largely about control. If you dictate their exact hours, if you tell them exactly how to write their code, or if you provide them with a company laptop, the government sees them as an employee.

SPEAKER_02 18:47

Even if you call them a contractor.

SPEAKER_01 18:49

Right. If you call them a contractor just to avoid paying minimum wage, the IRS and labor boards can hit you with massive back taxes, unpaid overtime claims, and just devastating civil penalties.

SPEAKER_02 19:00

So what does this all mean? Like for you, the listener, who literally has zero cash right now, how do you structure this early team safely?

SPEAKER_01 19:08

It means you must structure early team members as true, autonomous co-founders who share the high-level business risk. Or you bring them on as very carefully legally defined independent contractors who have total control over how and when they deliver their work.

SPEAKER_02 19:23

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 19:24

And regardless of what title you use, you must protect the company with a standard four-year vesting schedule and a one-year cliff until the company generates cash.

SPEAKER_02 19:33

Let's define that quickly because vesting and cliffs get thrown around a lot. What is the actual mechanism of a one-year cliff?

SPEAKER_01 19:40

Vesting just means you don't get all your equity on day one, you earn it over time, usually over four years. Right. The one year cliff is a safeguard. It means that for the first 364 days, the person officially owns 0% of the company. If they quit, or if you fire them on day 364, they walk away with nothing.

SPEAKER_02 20:01

Ouch. But necessary.

SPEAKER_01 20:04

But on day 365, the cliff, they instantly earn their entire first year's worth of equity, which is usually 25% of their total allocation.

SPEAKER_02 20:13

And why is it so important to do?

SPEAKER_01 20:15

Because it protects your cap table, that master ledger we talked about.

SPEAKER_02 20:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:18

If a co-founder works for three weeks, gets bored, and quits, you do not want them permanently owning 10% of your company forever.

SPEAKER_02 20:25

No, that would be terrible.

SPEAKER_01 20:27

Right. If that happens, your ledger is broken, and no future investor will ever touch your company.

SPEAKER_02 20:32

This is an absolute master class in early stage survival. Let's synthesize this ultimate playbook for you, our listener.

SPEAKER_01 20:40

Yeah, let's summarize it. Here is the exact sequence. First, you validate your idea using no-code tools to gain leverage and prove that the market actually wants your cookies.

SPEAKER_00 20:51

Right.

SPEAKER_01 20:52

Second, you pitch your vision using real customer evidence, targeting folks in your immediate network, or on high signal platforms like Startup Page where you can verify your revenue.

SPEAKER_02 21:02

Verification is key.

SPEAKER_01 21:03

Third, you date before you marry by executing a 10-hour mini project to test their friction response. And finally, you use a dynamic equity split based on actual daily risk rather than day one guesses, while ensuring you use a one-year cliff to say legally compliant.

SPEAKER_02 21:19

It is a brilliant logical roadmap. But as we wrap up, I want to leave you with the final slightly mind-bending thought. This wasn't explicitly spelled out in our sources, but it really feels like the natural conclusion to everything we've just discussed.

SPEAKER_01 21:31

I'm intrigued. Where are you going with this?

SPEAKER_02 21:33

All of these experts, YC, the Slicing Pie model, the startup lawyers, they all frame this zero cash, equity-only model as a survival tactic. It's pitched as a way to survive until you can finally raise venture capital or start paying big corporate salaries. But think about the mechanics of what you've actually built.

SPEAKER_00 21:51

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 21:52

If you perfectly execute this high trust, dynamic, equity-driven model where every single person on the team is deeply aligned, where they are rewarded for their exact level of risk, and you are building a product with actual verified revenue validation. Yeah. Do you even need VC money later?

SPEAKER_01 22:10

Oh wow. That is a completely different paradigm.

SPEAKER_02 22:13

Right. By being forced to operate with zero cash today, have you accidentally built the ultimate resilient bootstrapper machine, like a company that can scale entirely outside the traditional high-pressure financial system, all because your core team is motivated by pure ownership instead of a birekly paycheck.

SPEAKER_01 22:29

This raises an important question, really, for any founder starting out. Yeah. What kind of culture are you truly building from day zero when cash isn't the primary motivator?

SPEAKER_02 22:37

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 22:38

You aren't just hacking a temporary payroll problem. You are fundamentally coding the DNA of a highly accountable owner-operator company. That is incredibly powerful.

SPEAKER_02 22:49

It really is. To you listening right now, you are not at a disadvantage because you lack cash. You are actually building the skyscraper with a crew who wants to own the penthouse just as much as you do. Love that. We want to celebrate you again for bringing this massive challenge to us. If you want to deep dive custom tailored to your biggest roadblocks, write in your questions to tuepodcast.net ask pie. We are waiting for them.

SPEAKER_01 23:14

And please go down to the comments right now and share your own experiences building early teams without cash. We want to hear your stories, your brilliant wins, and you know, your absolute 10-hour project disasters.

SPEAKER_02 23:24

The blueprint is yours. Now go build the skyscraper.

SPEAKER_00 23:27

And that's a wrap, school believers. You just experienced the power of AI-driven business insights with Pi and Piet 2.0. Real advice, artificial voices, unlimited potential. If today's episode sparked an idea, challenged your thinking, or gave you that breakthrough moment, don't keep it to yourself. Share it with a fellow entrepreneur who needs to hear this. Got a burning business question? Want Pi and Piet to tackle your specific challenge? Head over to tuepodcast.net slash ask pie and submit your question right now. We'll dive deep into your issue and deliver the actionable strategies you need to get across the start line. Remember, school believers, the hurdles aren't in the way. The hurdles are the way. Until next time, keep moving forward, keep taking action, and we'll see you in the next episode.